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Malaphax

Computer Plans "Delta"

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kuhla   
Malaphax   

Everything is assembled, the computer is very quiet... except some coil whine coming from the psu. I'm probably going to have to RMA that... and then of course re-run all my wiring again... fuck. Anyhow, I just installed windows so we'll see if I manage to finish up most of the installations tonight.

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kuhla   

Everything is assembled, the computer is very quiet... except some coil whine coming from the psu. I'm probably going to have to RMA that... and then of course re-run all my wiring again... fuck. Anyhow, I just installed windows so we'll see if I manage to finish up most of the installations tonight.

If that coil whine doesn't go away in a day or two (which has happened to me before), RMA for sure. So you got your 680 already ya?...

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Malaphax   

Yup, everything looking solid, I'm actually checking on the coil whine, because I think it might have disappeared. If it has, then that's fantastic. Yea the 680 was some bs like I said, I guess their search results were cached which is why it was showing that it wasn't in stock on that page. I have no really messed with the overclock settings yet, I'll probably get around to that a little bit later this week, and see what I'd like to do, probably a mild overclock on the cpu and that's about it.

 

I also need to pull my hard drive from my old computer and transfer a bunch of files. I did that already last night for all my media and drivers, but I still need to pull over some other stuff like my games etc... Depending on how quick that goes, I might be relatively up and running by tonight and probably fully functional by this weekend. The only downside I've seen so far is sound, the usb portion of the dac works but as I mentioned before there is no real control on any sound except for on the dac itself, which is a little tricky, so I need to swap back to toslink connection.

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Malaphax   

I didn't want to shitpost in another thread so I'll just resurrect this one.

 

I'm debating changing out my case/cooling when I look to upgrade my GPU (to a gtx 1080).

I've come across a few ideas, all of them involve some level of increased size to accommodate more all in one watercooling solutions.

 

My first option would be a corsair 350d:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811139021&cm_re=corsair_350d-_-11-139-021-_-Product

 

It has plenty of mounts for fans/radiotors. I also found someone doing almost exactly what I had imagined with cpu/gpu cooling:

IMG_0502.JPG.23af1f9050739d7b6a18be901e5

The only thing he had to do was remove the 2.5" drive cage, but you can still mount 2.5" drives in the standard 3.5" cage so that's not a large issue.

 

The alternative would be the corsair carbide 88r:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811139068&cm_re=carbide_88r-_-11-139-068-_-Product

32ED2FD4445B4E06B8BBA84A6ECA83B0.jpg

I'm not entirely convinced this would work without a bit of weirdness, I think mounting another 120mm rad is possible on the back 120 mount, but you'd probably need to take out one of the top 120mm fans to do it.

 

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Malaphax   

I've still been considering coming back and upgrading my case and cooling setup. 

The new top contender for cases are the Inwin 301c (not currently released)
https://www.inwin-style.com/en/gaming-chassis/301c

This is a refresh of the currently released inwin 301, which has been solidly reviewed.

As far as cooling is concerned, I'm looking to keep things simple and upgrading my cpu cooler to a 240 rad and obviously buy some more fans. 
240 rad options I'm looking at are:
Corsair 110i v2.  I could also consider the corsair 105 but that has a fat radiator and I'm not sure I want to hassle of considering a thicker radiator.
NZXT X52.  It's very similar in terms of performance but it's a bit more expensive so I'd need to find it on sale. 
EDIT: I suppose I should also list the Fractal S24.  It also has the minor advantage of having very quiet stock fans. 

Fans are a bit trickier.  Kuhla linked me to this reviews for 120mm fans: http://www.overclockers.com/pwm-fan-roundup-twenty-four-120-mm-case-fans-tested/

The downside is that finding gentle typhoons is a rough prospect since they're not manufactured anymore.  There are a few places I've found that have them, especially this canadian dude who appears to have placed a large order from the manufacturer (and painted them black... why god why).
There are other options, but they either trade off extra noise or less cooling performance.  The best "runner up" deepcool is also hard to find.  But the Arctic F12 are fairly easy to get and cheap as hell. 

Not sure where I stand on all this, I have to think about cost/performance.  On one hand I'd love to have a case filled with some nice Gentle Typhoons, and on the other hand between cost and the fact that the Arctic F12's push almost the same unobstructed airflow as the gentle typhoons for 1/3 the cost and even lower noise make me consider doing something like buying GT's for the radiator and then F12's for the rest, or just getting a bunch of F12's and not worrying too much about the cooling performance. 

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Malaphax   

I'm started doing some mental exercises on GPU clearance and have come to the conclusion that I need to rethink how I mount a 240 rad with most of these cases. 
If I put the 240 rad in the front, that cuts gpu clearance down dramatically, and due to my 1080 being 290mm in length, it makes the entire process unworkable.  I've checked a few other options and so far I'm striking out on most of them once I start doing the math. 

There are some options of instead moving the cooling to the top/bottom of cases. The inwin 301c that I mentioned above has a bottom mounted radiator option that would probably block some of the expansion slots (not great) and then normal 2x120mm front intakes, I would just need to be sure I can route the hoses either over the top of the gpu (ugly) or in front of the gpu which gives me ~40mm and puts them pretty close to the front intake fans, which is probably doable.

It looks like the Corsair Carbide 88r or m2 (updated) does have enough clearance for a more standard layout with a front mounted 240mm radiator and my oversized gpu.  The only downside of these cases are a complete lack of dust filters. 
Cooler Master Silencio 352  hits all the marks, I guess that's a decent option. 

Phanteks Evolv Matx would work if I used the top 240 (or 280) mounting position.
Fractal Mini C would work with the top 240 rad, however there is a note about 40mm max mobo height restrictions. 
Fractal Core 1500 would work with the top 240 rad - again notes on mobo height restrictions. 

I suppose I should go back to looking at the Corsair 350D

If I'm feeling especially defeatist I could just say fuck it and bump all the way up to a mid tower.  Although that seems like a shitty solution.  At least something like the NZXT S340 or the Corsair 400C aren't gargantuan but still not my preference. 

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kuhla   

 

On 8/22/2017 at 10:28 AM, Malaphax said:

As far as cooling is concerned, I'm looking to keep things simple and upgrading my cpu cooler to a 240 rad and obviously buy some more fans. 
240 rad options I'm looking at are:
Corsair 110i v2.  I could also consider the corsair 105 but that has a fat radiator and I'm not sure I want to hassle of considering a thicker radiator.
NZXT X52.  It's very similar in terms of performance but it's a bit more expensive so I'd need to find it on sale. 
EDIT: I suppose I should also list the Fractal S24.  It also has the minor advantage of having very quiet stock fans. 

I don't see the Corsair 105 listed on their site anymore ( http://www.corsair.com/en-us/cooling ). Could be an old model?

One thing I'm sort of worried about with their AIO moving forward is the newest ones ( H80i v2, H100i v2, H115i ) all have this rigid tube coming out of the block. I worry about that being harder to route. If you look at their older models, like the H100i that I have, the tubes are on a sort of swivel attached to the block. Yes it is more points of failure, possibly more flow restriction, and the new design/OEM may perform better (I don't know that), but I have to imagine routing is easier with the older models since you swivel to the side if clearance above the block is an issue.

On 8/22/2017 at 10:28 AM, Malaphax said:

Fans are a bit trickier.  Kuhla linked me to this reviews for 120mm fans: http://www.overclockers.com/pwm-fan-roundup-twenty-four-120-mm-case-fans-tested/

The downside is that finding gentle typhoons is a rough prospect since they're not manufactured anymore.  There are a few places I've found that have them, especially this canadian dude who appears to have placed a large order from the manufacturer (and painted them black... why god why).
There are other options, but they either trade off extra noise or less cooling performance.  The best "runner up" deepcool is also hard to find.  But the Arctic F12 are fairly easy to get and cheap as hell. 

Not sure where I stand on all this, I have to think about cost/performance.  On one hand I'd love to have a case filled with some nice Gentle Typhoons, and on the other hand between cost and the fact that the Arctic F12's push almost the same unobstructed airflow as the gentle typhoons for 1/3 the cost and even lower noise make me consider doing something like buying GT's for the radiator and then F12's for the rest, or just getting a bunch of F12's and not worrying too much about the cooling performance. 

There are a couple of fan roundups here that I have also read that you may find useful: https://us.hardware.info/category/23/case-fans/reviews

Those Noiseblocker eLoop fans are still around. I think they look awesome and I like the idea behind the design but if I recall correctly the reviews for them are kind of all over the place (usually anywhere between above-average to best) and they are really expensive ($30 I think). I would rather put my faith in something a little more tried and true that reviews consistently in big roundups.

When I had my F12s, I had them in pull on a radiator. I blamed them for certain issues but I realized much later that they were not the cause. For a long time they did all the cooling I needed, were quiet and were not expensive. If I had not misdiagnosed my issue, I probably would have never upgraded to the Gentle Typhoons.

I feel that a lot of fans (not all) are overpriced based on name or hype or whatever. Of course it's also RGB ALL THE THINGS now.

140mm is also pretty well established at this point but I think some of the best quality fans are still at the 120mm size and in some cases, the better 120mm fans outperform some of the middle-of-the-pack 140mm fans.

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kuhla   
23 minutes ago, Malaphax said:

I'm started doing some mental exercises on GPU clearance and have come to the conclusion that I need to rethink how I mount a 240 rad with most of these cases. 
If I put the 240 rad in the front, that cuts gpu clearance down dramatically, and due to my 1080 being 290mm in length, it makes the entire process unworkable.  I've checked a few other options and so far I'm striking out on most of them once I start doing the math. 

There are some options of instead moving the cooling to the top/bottom of cases. The inwin 301c that I mentioned above has a bottom mounted radiator option that would probably block some of the expansion slots (not great) and then normal 2x120mm front intakes, I would just need to be sure I can route the hoses either over the top of the gpu (ugly) or in front of the gpu which gives me ~40mm and puts them pretty close to the front intake fans, which is probably doable.

It looks like the Corsair Carbide 88r or m2 (updated) does have enough clearance for a more standard layout with a front mounted 240mm radiator and my oversized gpu.  The only downside of these cases are a complete lack of dust filters. 
Cooler Master Silencio 352  hits all the marks, I guess that's a decent option. 

Phanteks Evolv Matx would work if I used the top 240 (or 280) mounting position.
Fractal Mini C would work with the top 240 rad, however there is a note about 40mm max mobo height restrictions. 
Fractal Core 1500 would work with the top 240 rad - again notes on mobo height restrictions. 

I suppose I should go back to looking at the Corsair 350D

If I'm feeling especially defeatist I could just say fuck it and bump all the way up to a mid tower.  Although that seems like a shitty solution.  At least something like the NZXT S340 or the Corsair 400C aren't gargantuan but still not my preference. 

Double post because I was writing the last post while you posted.

Don't go up to an ATX size case if you are stick to mATX motherboards..... that's just..... euhh....

What about this? Cooler Master MasterCase Pro 3 : http://www.coolermaster.com/case/mini-tower/mastercase-pro-3/

It can supposedly fits up to a 280 rad up top with some restrictions. Review: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/cooler-master-micro-atx-mastercase-pro-3-liquid-cooling-case,4734.html

I have become sensitive to the idea of dust management.

image.png

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Malaphax   

I believe corsair did some rebranding a while back and the 105 is totally gone now, it was the extra thick rad and I have a feeling it caused problems for most case fits.  The 100i is older stock with slightly smaller tubing and technically a thinner radiator at 27mm vs 30mm for the 110i v2.  I'm not super concerned about routing tubing, as long as it doesn't have to make some ultra sharp 90 degree turns it should be fine. 

I currently have the noiseblocker eloop in pull on my radiator.  It's not terrible, I think the front 200mm fan I have probably creates slightly more noise. 

Speaking of push vs pull.  I remember a long time ago you mentioned pull was better I can't exactly recall why.  I've briefly googled some tests and saw that push tended to have slightly better performance, like 1-2 degrees difference.  I'm assuming this has to be taken in the greater context of where it's being mounted and what the total airflow of the case is. 

I've looked at 280mm rads and the associated 140mm fans.  Short answer is the radiators have slightly better cooling performance but I think 120 is a much bigger standard and has better quality fan options.

That coolermaster case you posted is actually bigger than the Corsair 400Q/C and the NZXT S340 I posted above.  It's actually pretty fucking huge for matx.  The modular stuff is nice, but I have a feeling I'd be tossing almost all of it. 
Coolermaster MasterCase 3: 467 x 235 x 505mm
Corsair 400Q/C: 425 x 215 x 464mm
NZXT S340: 200 x 445 x 432mm

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kuhla   

Triple post.

Fractal Design Define Mini C Black Window is on sale.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811352065

It's super basic looking (like my case, which it is very similar to) but as far as I can tell it matches all the requirements you have and has reasonable dust management. According to this review, they fit an H100i in the front and fit a 295mm GPU too even though top mounted options is also still there https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Cases-and-Cooling/Fractal-Design-Define-C-Micro-ATX-Case-Review/Build-Process

280 rads are a tad thinner though? Makes more room?

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Malaphax   

Fractal Define Mini C: "Graphics cards up to 315mm in length with front fans mounted"
I did look up that review on PCPer and after checking the card length, 295mm like you mentioned, I mean I guess it fits... that's scary as hell though. 

I also need to determine how much cooling I want vs how much noise I'm comfortable with.  The Define Mini C for example could fit 5 (or more) 120mm fans on it, but I'd need to figure out if I wanted to do that or cut it down to 3 - 2x120 in front with the 240 rad and 1x120 in the back for exhaust.  If I really needed more cooling I could put an additional 2x120 on the top for exhaust but I'm sure that would add some noise. 
It does have the same front panel/side grating that you're slamming the corsair 88r for, albiet slightly less restrictive. 

280 rads are thinner... by 3-4mm.  I'd rather not be that close, but depending on how accurate the pcper review is on the define mini c, I just might be.  The Corsair 400Q is basically 1" longer and 2" taller than the define mini c, and has the same or better cooling and clearance as well as the same sound dampening material on the panels.   While I appreciate the sale at newegg - I'd actually pay the extra $10 for the windowless version of the define mini c, I sorta wish white was an option. 

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kuhla   
4 hours ago, Malaphax said:

Fractal Define Mini C: "Graphics cards up to 315mm in length with front fans mounted"
I did look up that review on PCPer and after checking the card length, 295mm like you mentioned, I mean I guess it fits... that's scary as hell though. 

If it doesn't fit then return it?

4 hours ago, Malaphax said:

I also need to determine how much cooling I want vs how much noise I'm comfortable with.  The Define Mini C for example could fit 5 (or more) 120mm fans on it, but I'd need to figure out if I wanted to do that or cut it down to 3 - 2x120 in front with the 240 rad and 1x120 in the back for exhaust.  If I really needed more cooling I could put an additional 2x120 on the top for exhaust but I'm sure that would add some noise. 

Keep in mind that even if fans are quiet, the more you have, the noise will do add up. 3-4 decent 120mm fans with the intakes being relatively "open" I think is plenty for most people who are doing a little overclocking and live in a warm climate. I'm personally a fan of positive pressure (intake > exhaust)..

4 hours ago, Malaphax said:

It does have the same front panel/side grating that you're slamming the corsair 88r for, albiet slightly less restrictive.

Metal mesh + plastic grill combo = I do not like. I had it on my last case.

4 hours ago, Malaphax said:

 280 rads are thinner... by 3-4mm.  I'd rather not be that close, but depending on how accurate the pcper review is on the define mini c, I just might be.  The Corsair 400Q is basically 1" longer and 2" taller than the define mini c, and has the same or better cooling and clearance as well as the same sound dampening material on the panels.   While I appreciate the sale at newegg - I'd actually pay the extra $10 for the windowless version of the define mini c, I sorta wish white was an option. 

Why not the 350D? It's mATX unlike the 400. That has top 240 rad space if you don't want to worry about gpu length restrictions.

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Malaphax   

Yea I'm not a huge fan of returning cases, but I guess with newegg I could drop it off at their warehouse. 

Yea, right now I'm at 1x200mm front fan and 1x120mm fan in pull with a radiator for exhaust.  However, the psu does draw air direct from the outside.  My proposed setup is 2x120mm fans with a 240 rad in front (possibly in push) and 1x120mm as an exhaust.  The top 2x120mm would be if the temps aren't up to par or the fans need to spin at higher rates. 

This is a picture of the 350d with a standard 30mm rad (alphacool st30) installed.  Notice your clearance is TIGHT.  I expect either that level of tight or even some minor overlap when using a top mounted 240 rad.  In fact most of the cases mention clearance restrictions for top mounted 240 rads.  On the one hand if you use a 240mm rad in top mounted push configuration, you get solid exhaust and allow for really good air intake as well as the use of some drive cages in the case.  On the downside you are cramming that shit in there and will most likely be using all 5 fan slots as well as making the setup negative pressure. 
If I find something that mounts a 240mm rad in front it means I can either use a positive pressure (2 intake 1 exhaust) setup with less fans and less noise, or go whole hog again and use the top for exhaust.  It provides more options. 

The reason why I'm even bringing up the "small" mid-towers from corsair and nzxt is that the extra 1-2 inches in depth/height completely eliminate any issues with clearance and allow me to just chuck my stuff in there.  I mean technically if I ever upgrade to a full sized atx platform it would support that as well, but I'm more interested in their ability to handle 240/280mm radiators in front mounting without issue.  It's a cop out but considering they both look decent it would be stupid to completely dismiss the idea. 

Current stack ranking is Define C Mini, Corsair 400Q, Corsair 350D, NZXT S340

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Malaphax   

400C is with the window (C for Clear panel?) and 400Q does not have the window (Q for Quiet). 

I don't have any idea when these plans will come to fruition, currently have other things I'm more focused on. 

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