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kuhla

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soo in Wyoming i can go to the store and buy semi automatic rifle with just money in my pocket and nothing else ? or only for private sales like craigslist style? 

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If you went to a store in Wyoming (as a resident of Wyoming) they'd run a National Instant Criminal Background Check (NICS) check on you which is mostly instant.  There are some occasions if you have a very common name where they might take longer or even deny you incorrectly.  This part is somewhat grey area - legally the FBI has 72 hours to issue a Yes/No response to a NICS check, sometimes the seller/FFL will give you the gun after those 3 days if they have not had a response, sometimes they might hold the gun until you work it out with the feds.  It depends on the state and the FFL who's handling the sale. 

For private sales in Wyoming, you'd just give the guy money and he'd give you the gun.  Most responsible adults would either run a background check or make sure you're authorized to purchase a firearm in some fashion, they might use an FFL as a middle man (unlikely in WY, but it's the law in CA).  Often they will also create a bill of sale for everyone's records. 

There are websites like armslist, gunbroker and even /r/gunsforsale which will sell guns online.  These will almost always go through an FFL (the gun is shipped to the FFL, not to your house).  There are some very small exceptions for "collectible and antiquities" which would be really old rifles like from WWII and technically if you get the right permits you can have those shipped to your door. 
Most states also allow you to buy ammo and ship it to your door (but not CA, because fuck you), however ammo must be shipped by UPS/FedEx and cannot be held by the courier so if it's undeliverable they ship it back. 

Also gun rentals at gun ranges are a thing, but most places require that you either be in a group of 2+ or own your own firearm before they rent you anything.  This is to prevent suicides. 

@Richard
That's not true, there are multiple factors at play before you're branded a criminal.  CA does have certain laws limiting what firearms can be purchased/imported but not every state is like that.

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1 hour ago, T1no said:

soo in Wyoming i can go to the store and buy semi automatic rifle with just money in my pocket and nothing else ? or only for private sales like craigslist style? 

If you are a resident of Wyoming and the NICS check comes back OK (while in-store) then yes: walk in store with cash, walk out with gun.

 

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The supreme court decided not to hear 2 cases from California today.  One of which was a $19 transfer fee for private gun sales and the other was the 10 day waiting period for firearms purchases (even if you already own a firearm and have passed a background check). 

http://www.apnewsarchive.com/2018/The-Supreme-Court-is-rejecting-two-challenges-by-guns-rights-groups-to-California-laws-regulating-firearms-sales/id-ec9cfcba0a4f4feab126a304ccb53761

Justice Clarence Thomas is the most pro-gun supreme court justice and he released a scathing dissent regarding the lack of action by the supreme court on any 2nd amendment issue.  pdf warning: https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/17pdf/17-342_4hd5.pdf

Quote

If a lower court treated another right so cavalierly, I have little doubt that this Court would intervene. But as evidenced by our continued inaction in this area, the Second Amendment is a disfavored right in this court. Because I do not believe we should be in the business of choosing which constitutional rights are “really worth insisting upon,” Heller, supra, at 634, I would have granted certiorari in this case.

Putting aside my bias on the matter.  At this point, the political reality is the 9th court of appeals is setting gun laws for the west coast and is setting precedent for the rest of the country.  I fully expect more onerous laws to be passed by California and that they will be appealed all the way to the 9th court only to be upheld.  Looking at the dramatic disparity between what the 2nd amendment means in CA, NJ, NY compared to most other states is frustrating to say the least. 

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do you think something gonna happen soon ?

most like the answer is ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ HONESTLY

the media and the kids are mad right now.

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9 minutes ago, T1no said:

do you think something gonna happen soon ?

most like the answer is ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ HONESTLY

the media and the kids are mad right now.

I think it's very possible that nothing will happen right now (president, supreme court) but after "Blue Midterm 2018" and what is probably coming in the next couple of years, yes, I think the pendulum will swing. I fell the rhetoric and emotion is at an all time high right now.

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On 2/20/2018 at 11:56 AM, kuhla said:

I'm very much wondering if this will come back:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Assault_Weapons_Ban

imb4 a huge increase in purchases of stripped lowers as a form of investment for grandfathering

source - https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/17/us/prominent-republican-donor-issues-ultimatum-on-assault-weapons.html?smid=tw-share

Quote

 

A prominent Republican political donor demanded on Saturday that the party pass legislation to restrict access to guns, and vowed not to contribute to any candidates or electioneering groups that did not support a ban on the sale of military-style firearms to civilians.

Al Hoffman Jr., a Florida-based real estate developer who was a leading fund-raiser for George W. Bush’s campaigns, said he would seek to marshal support among other Republican political donors for a renewed assault weapons ban.
....

 

DO MY BIDDING OR I WILL STOP SENDING YOU MONEY

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As someone correctly pointed out.  The fact that a major donor threatening to withhold campaign contributions is news speaks to how fucked our current political system is. 

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This is a clearly biased video from the NRA.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyI3uSk1xLw&feature=youtu.be
It is also one of the most subdued videos I've seen them post.  I generally dislike the NRA for a variety of reasons, but I also understand that some people inside the NRA do good work that I can agree with. 
The video is not without flaws, but I'd argue it's a better response than I've seen from many high ranking members of the NRA. 

Sidenote: I actually have more respect for people who say "I want to ban all guns" than I do for the people/legislators who want push for death by a thousand cuts through legislative overreach.  If a large portion of this country wants to remove or change the 2nd amendment, I think that's a conversation we can and should have.  I think some people treat the constitution as a holy grail that should never be changed or altered, when in reality, the founding fathers provided us the basis to change the constitution.  People act like we haven't changed the constitution before, or that amendments are infallible (18th amendment anyone?).  This goes beyond gun laws and the 2nd amendment, but I'd love to see the 4th amendment changed to include more detailed language about the right to privacy.  I'd also love to see citizens united and laws regarding political donations or corporate personhood properly handled. 

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I wanted to briefly link to this short video someone posted on /r/guns subreddit because it does a decent job of showing what current California compliance can look like. 

Brief background.  Currently in California there are certain restrictions around rifles and "assault weapons."  There are basically 3 options available.

  1. Register an existing assault weapon with the state.  Most gun owners do not recommend this for a number of reasons, not the least of which is that the gun cannot be transferred to family, and will most likely become California's property when you die. 
  2. Remove all the "evil features" on the gun.  These evil features include very basic things such as (but not limited to): pistol grips, flash hiders, foregrips and adjustable stocks. 
  3. Install a fixed magazine that requires disassembling the action in order to remove the fixed magazine. 

This video is addressing #3, it basically follows the letter of the law, by allowing you to "disassemble" a standard AR-15 style rifle very quickly and easily providing you with access to remove the fixed magazine and go on about your day. 

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/guns/comments/85m4vg/california_conversion_to_fixed_mag_ar15/

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This is not a joke.  This is current California law. 
If you ever wondered why so many pro-gun individuals from other states hate when people talk about "assault weapon" bans or suggest that California has retarded gun laws, this is why.  Keep in mind that because California gun laws change on a very regular basis (sometimes yearly) you could have bought/owned a standard AR-15 style rifle and suddenly wake up one day as a felon because the laws have changed.  I personally find these types of legislative efforts to be stupid at best, and actively suppressing the 2nd amendment at worst. 

The assault rifle registration has multiple issues with it, but I've heard that if your registered assault rifle is not within certain compliance windows they literally send law enforcement to your door and take the gun away.  This is for rifles that would be legal in most other states.  The fact that they make it completely non-transferable, means that if you die, your estate has 90 days to find a state approved FFL that can handle the sale of assault rifles, or they send law enforcement to come and take it away. 

The featureless style rifles can look like a cross between something incredibly stupid and something futuristic.  It depends on how much you spend and what parts you use.  Here are some examples of featureless rifles that meet California (current) compliance. 
The last two images are rifles that you can buy direct from a manufacturer. 
Thordsen-Customs-3G-2-660x220.jpg

 

Stag-Arms-9mm-AR-15-1024x716.jpg

Stag-2TF-Featureless-AR-15-768x365.jpg

rdbs-right.png

If you want to get really mad.  You can also look up how we banned online purchases of ammunition on 1/1/18.  Better yet, California is current set to require background checks on ammunition purchases starting 7/1/19.  Just as a note, New York tried the background check on ammo thing, it was later cancelled (technically put on indefinite hold) by the NY governor, partially because they had no idea how to implement it.  The NICS system is designed to be used for firearms purchases not for ammo purchases.  There's a chance the FBI or ATF will come down like a sack of bricks on CA when they try to implement their system.  It will absolutely end up in the courts and possibly go all the way to the Supreme court, but we'll have to deal with the bullshit in the meantime. 

There's a reason why most pro-gun people in California hate the nonsensical laws that our state passes.  It punishes law abiding citizens and does absolutely nothing to stop legitimate crimes. 

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let me guess. the first picture is some bs with  "it cannot have a butt stock"

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The first picture solves 2 issues, it has a fixed butstock and also does not have a pistol grip.  The buttstock has to be fixed, this is mostly to ban collapsible buttstocks and to act as another barrier to keep the overall length of the rifle as long as possible.  Technically the way the "no pistol grip" part of the law is written is as follows:

Quote

"pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon" means a grip that allows for a pistol style grasp in which the web of the trigger hand (between the thumb and index (finger) can be placed below the top of the exposed portion of the trigger while firing.

Source: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/regs/chapter39.pdf

Thankfully, AR-15 style rifles are basically like legos.  You can relatively easily slap on different parts without too much work.  Most of the modifications I've seen posted are reversible.

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Interesting to see the comparative search requests of the term "gun control" after some of the more recent shootings compared to past shootings. 

6k37asgu6an01.png

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I'm posting this as a semi-related issue. 

The UK has some of the strictest gun laws in the world, but that doesn't stop violent crime.  From my personal experience traveling there repeatedly, one of the major differences between their police and ours is that our police wear bulletproof vests, and theirs were stab proof vests.  The UK also has some of the strictest knife laws in the world, going so far as to punish anyone caught carrying a knife on their person unless it is directly related to their job and they are on their way to/from the job site. 

Here is the mayor of London calling for even more draconian knife laws, now that multiple stabbing attacks have happened. 
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/04/09/london-mayor-knife-control/500328002/

I want to point out two incredibly obvious points.

  1. These knife attacks are overwhelming linked to gangs and criminals
  2. The current draconian laws have not been effective

I don't generally make slippery slope arguments, but whenever I see people speak about gun control or any laws that limit freedom "for our security" I get rather defensive.  Where does it end?

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On 2/20/2018 at 11:56 AM, kuhla said:

I'm very much wondering if this will come back:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Assault_Weapons_Ban

imb4 a huge increase in purchases of stripped lowers as a form of investment for grandfathering

I don't know if this is new or not.

H.R.5087 - Assault Weapons Ban of 2018

https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/5087/text

Quote

Ms. Brownley of California

Ms. Judy Chu of California

Mrs. Davis of California

Mr. Ted Lieu of California

Mr. Swalwell of California

Ms. Maxine Waters of California

 

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The California Supreme Court says state laws cannot be invalidated on the grounds that complying with them is impossible.

The unanimous ruling on Thursday rejected a lawsuit by gun rights groups that sought to throw out a California law that requires new models of semi-automatic handguns to stamp identifying information on bullet casings. The groups argued that technology did not exist to meet the stamping requirements, and a law can't mandate something that's not possible.

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/business/article213997664.html

The government argument boils down to: "We think regulations should spur innovation, we've done similar things with emissions standards.  The gun companies need to come up with a solution"

The National Shooting Sports Foundation's argument is roughly: "You're asking for something that is technologically impossible, it results in a de-facto ban and restriction of any new firearms being added to California's approved pistol roster."

Please take note, this is one of the few cases where the original court ruled in favor of the state, the appellate court overturned that ruling in favor of the plaintiffs, and the California supreme court overturned that ruling in favor of the state again.
There are other court cases with very similar arguments currently going through the courts, namely: Pena v Cid.  That is currently under review of the 9th circuit (above California Supreme Court) and has been sitting there for a long time... since 2015. 

Regardless of my very obvious bias in this issue, my problem with this ruling is that it would set a absolutely disgusting precedent.

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